Wishlist thread

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Lord_Raiden
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Lord_Raiden » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:13 pm

rmsgrey wrote:
Lord_Raiden wrote:bugfix:
1) once, I saw a guy move into my LOS for a brief period in turn 1. haven't seen the guy for many turns after that. A guy stepped into the same space after 5 turns but I wasn't sure it was the same guy. I killed him in that exchange. A shadow vanished from the starting point. THanks to that I now knew it was another guy and my guy from turn one was pinned in that spot too. somehow, a player should select which shadow to delete to prevent this very minor exploit.
Why shouldn't you be able to tell whether it was Tom, Dick or Harry that you spotted this time? After all, you can tell your own interchangeable machine gunners apart...

Either way, I'd call it a design decision, not a bug...
I do know where my units are, but enemy doesn't. Was it the one that I saw peeking out of the window, or the one I saw trying to get round that building? Or the one I expect to get to that cover overlooking half of my flank? This is a crucial knowledge altering the real strategic situation, and changing my future decisions! Still see this situation as a very minor, but still an exploit.
Lord_Raiden
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Lord_Raiden » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:06 pm

cheekorobbins wrote:Thoughts regarding Rockets after a stalemate game where we only had a rocket guy each and it's impossible to kill each other if you just stand away from any scenery.

a) It would be great if the rockets detonated on contact with an enemy, direct hits!
Seconding that.
cheekorobbins wrote: b) Maybe the enemy can't see the rocket trail until it gets within a certain radius of their team members? If you end up with your rocket guy firing a rocket just before the round ends the enemy can see it so it gives away your rocket guy's position and also gives the enemy plenty of time to guarantee they don't get killed in the blast.
Seconding that. If the rocket is not seen, it is not visible. Not sure how to tackle the sound though, can that be precisely pinpointed to a place on the map?

a) if so, then the rocket is visible at the launch, and all the way.
b) if not, dangerous precedens is introduced, the rocket might be indicated in the form of a "sonar beep" randomly positioned somewhere round the rocket guy. This means that the player must be able to guess the rocket for his future planning phase by having an option to place the rocket somewhere on the map and observe the outcome. The "shadow" rocket would be replaced by the real one only when the explosion occurs / the rocket is spotted.

Despite the fact that I don't like the idea of randomness too much, it is probably better than knowing where the real rocket got fired from.

Same goes for nades, they might be more precisely pinpointed by a "beep" but their trajectory obscured too.
cheekorobbins wrote:
c) Perhaps you could set a timer on a rocket so it detonates where you want? Maybe offset this by making it take noticably longer to fire to avoid overpowering the weapon. I find rockets can become redundant once key scenery has been destroyed and the enemy know where to stay away from potential explosions.
Explosion on contact should be enough. Rocket aimed at ground, imho quite impossible at the ranges we play, and timed for 1 sec even more so.
Lord_Raiden
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Lord_Raiden » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:26 pm

kaoD wrote:
Minifig wrote:Came in here to say sort of the same thing, specifically I'd like the ability to give units a "speak" order that causes them to pop up a speech bubble with the (short) text I entered.

It is really frivolous, but I like the idea of my gunner popping round the corner, shouting "Surprise!" and blowing someone away :
Made me want the feature!
Hillarious idea. Especially considering the insane amount of time the shout would not work the way intended :-) Definitly must introduce at least a 0.5 sec wait for that unit for doing this ! :-)

"Here I come" shouted Shotgun Bob as he sprinted round the next corner only to stare into the muzzle of a prepared machinegun popping out of a nearby pile of crates. It was his last words of course.
Lord_Raiden
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Lord_Raiden » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:32 pm

skyboy26 wrote:IMO it'd be better if the opponent couldn't see when you make a zone. On the note of zones, I also think it'd be nice if there were a visible box when dragging to make the zone so you could see what you're doing better, and also if there were an option to delete the zone (there might be one but I just couldn't find it?).

Anyway I think if the enemy knows where you put a zone, the only way to prevent giving them insight into what you're doing would be to zone up the entire map :|
Did it once, and worked like a charm :-) first turn victory. And I don't think enemy was buying the bait of me pretenting that I have made a mistake.
rmsgrey
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by rmsgrey » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:49 pm

Lord_Raiden wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:
Lord_Raiden wrote:bugfix:
1) once, I saw a guy move into my LOS for a brief period in turn 1. haven't seen the guy for many turns after that. A guy stepped into the same space after 5 turns but I wasn't sure it was the same guy. I killed him in that exchange. A shadow vanished from the starting point. THanks to that I now knew it was another guy and my guy from turn one was pinned in that spot too. somehow, a player should select which shadow to delete to prevent this very minor exploit.
Why shouldn't you be able to tell whether it was Tom, Dick or Harry that you spotted this time? After all, you can tell your own interchangeable machine gunners apart...

Either way, I'd call it a design decision, not a bug...
I do know where my units are, but enemy doesn't. Was it the one that I saw peeking out of the window, or the one I saw trying to get round that building? Or the one I expect to get to that cover overlooking half of my flank? This is a crucial knowledge altering the real strategic situation, and changing my future decisions! Still see this situation as a very minor, but still an exploit.
I see it as a design choice, not as an exploit - Mode 7 have decided that you can identify the individual enemy units on sight - so, when you sight an enemy unit, you know what they're armed with, and which number they are.

It would also be a legitimate design choice to only let you find out what they were armed with by seeing them fire, and not be able to distinguish by number until the replays.

They could also choose not to let you know the enemy's unit mix and starting locations. That doesn't make it a bug or an exploit to have that information (which is rather less realistic than being able to spot distinguishing features once you do see them)
goldensundude
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by goldensundude » Tue Jul 05, 2011 9:20 am

I know you guys are really busy working on server updates before you do any game mechanic updates to Frozen Synapse, but I have some brief suggestions. I apologize in advance if these have already been mentioned.

1) Allow players to surrender.

2) Allow a matchmaking state which does not allow anyone but friends to challenge you while you are in that state.

3) Allow the creator of a match to set a turn time limit. If the turn time limit were set to 60 seconds for example, then each player would be given 60 seconds to do their planning phase for a given turn and if they do not commit their plan after the 60 seconds are up, their plan as it stands after those 60 seconds is automatically committed.

4) Allow the creator of a match to set an overall time limit similar to that of speed chess. For example, suppose each player is given an overall time limit of five minutes. If at any time the sum of all of the time spent planning by a player is equal to or greater than five minutes, that player automatically forfeits.

5) Allow a player who is challenged to see what options the creator of the match chose for 3) and 4) and decline the challenge if such time restrictions are unsatisfactory.

Thank you for making such an awesome game and I can't wait to see what you guys decide to include in future updates :).
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NDervish
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by NDervish » Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:46 am

Lord_Raiden wrote:Heck, its mostly 5 sec turns, one can synchronize by try & adjust method.
That brings something else to mind which I don't recall having seen suggested before: An alternate delay timer which delays to an absolute time within the upcoming round. The existing timer doesn't quite manage that because it will go off late if the unit attempts to engage an enemy prior to the timer's expiration. This can definitely happen if an enemy is engaged while moving before the timer starts (causing the unit's arrival at the waypoint with the timer to be delayed) and I'm pretty sure that it will also happen if the unit spots an enemy while the timer is running down (it looks like the timer stops while attempting to track or fire on a target).
Lord_Raiden wrote:b) if not, dangerous precedens is introduced, the rocket might be indicated in the form of a "sonar beep" randomly positioned somewhere round the rocket guy... Despite the fact that I don't like the idea of randomness too much, it is probably better than knowing where the real rocket got fired from.
No randomness is required. As with the existing case of deciding the winner of an exactly-matched firefight, calculations can be made based on factors which are both non-obvious and outside of the firing player's control (e.g., the exact pixel each member of the opposing squad is standing on and the microsecond-resolution time within the round when the rocket is launched) to generate a result which is unpredictable, but still deterministic.
schpat
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by schpat » Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:01 pm

I would love in game tournaments, so that tournaments don't have to be organised outside of the game.

There would obviously have to be many settings:

Number of players
Turn Time Limit
Type of game
Round Robin/Knock Out

I would suggest that random maps be used, the same map in every first round game, then players ranked against the ones that played the same side as they did. Games should run concurrently. Missing a turn should not knock the player out, but his turn should automatically be primed. That way the other player can still finish.

Every round a new random map can be generated.
zarakon
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by zarakon » Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:27 pm

1.
When working with plan layers, it can sometimes become difficult to find the beginning and end of the plan because the Prev and Next buttons just wrap around. If I have a repeated route where the beginning, middle, and end all look the same, it's almost impossible to navigate.

Possible solutions:
a) Make the Prev/Next buttons stop at the first and last layers of the plan
b) Add an indicator for which layer of the plan is currently shown
c) Add buttons to select the First/Last layers.


2.
The in-game chat feature would be much better if each game had its own chat log attached to it. Ideally you could send your opponent a message while he's offline or otherwise not viewing the game, and he would see it the next time he viewed the game.
Niopii
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Niopii » Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:03 am

goldensundude wrote:
3) Allow the creator of a match to set a turn time limit. If the turn time limit were set to 60 seconds for example, then each player would be given 60 seconds to do their planning phase for a given turn and if they do not commit their plan after the 60 seconds are up, their plan as it stands after those 60 seconds is automatically committed.

4) Allow the creator of a match to set an overall time limit similar to that of speed chess. For example, suppose each player is given an overall time limit of five minutes. If at any time the sum of all of the time spent planning by a player is equal to or greater than five minutes, that player automatically forfeits.
For number 3. I could see this being a specific game type in it's own, like how we have light and dark extermination, we can have light/dark timed extermination. I'd prefer it be it's own category instead of it being an option in game, because that would over rule the possibility to play multiple games at once, or hopping off and simply picking up where you left off. I feel it would be necessary to decline this type of match as timed games would stick you to the computer, where as there are people out there that do not play the game this way.

As for 4. There would have to be a pause timer button which blacks out the game screen so neither team can see the board to physically AND mentally prepare strategies. I say this because unlike speed chess in rl, there may be times where a person is forced to afk for one reason or another. I do not feel it necessary to force some one to lose a match because something was pulling him or her away from the computer. Again, as you've already stated, there would have to be a deny challenge option set in. Sometimes I get challenged just seconds before I was about to log. That would be more annoying than anything if I got a speed challenge.

I donno if it was already mentioned, but I personally would like to see Draws count as Draws instead of wins. I know they don't affect score, but it's a bit odd seeing my score is so high when at the end of the day a bunch of them are actually draws. For example, I believe i'm sitting at 7 wins, 3 losses when actually my score should probably be something like 4 wins, 3 draws, 3 losses. Having that 7 there creates the illusion that I'm better than I actually am, and I don't want that.

A capture the flag/search and destroy game type would be interesting to see. CTF sounds like it would take a really long time, especially if teams are allowed to respawn. Of course a round limit will be involved. Player with the most captures wins. If the game ends at 0-0 it is a draw, thus players have to make an effort to actually capture the flag instead of sitting back and defending.

Search and Destroy, if you've played CoD then... This would be perfect for this game. Basically, 1 team defends 2 locations while the opposition has to send a person to one of those locations to set up a bomb. If/when that happens, a timer is set (in the form of rounds or there is an actual timer), and then the defending team has to get in there and disarm it. If either team kills off the opposition, it's a win. If the offensive team has the bomb explode successfully, it's a win for them. If the defensive team is able to disarm the bomb, then THEY win. If the opposing team is able to set up the bomb near the end of the match limit, then I feel the match should go into overtime just enough for the bomb to either be disarmed or go off.

A mostly cosmetic feature. I feel it would be pretty neat to go into first person of one of your team units ala Dungeon Keeper during the prime phase of the game, or even during the replay. Of course you can't control this unit, but just watch the action through his eyes.
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NDervish
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by NDervish » Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:21 am

Niopii wrote:For number 3. I could see this being a specific game time in it's own, like how we have light and dark extermination, we can have light/dark timed extermination.
I've been thinking about the possibility of separating victory conditions and visibility rule out into separate lists (i.e., one selection for extermination/charge/hostage/etc. and a second for light/dark instead of listing light this/dark this/light that/dark that/... all in one big list). Adding a third selection for timed/non-timed would follow easily from that, although it would have to be a "hard" setting (i.e., if you don't have "timed" selected, you absolutely will not ever get pulled into a timed game) for the reasons you've already given. (I'm one of the people who doesn't play FS in a way compatible with speed games... I try to have several games active at any given time and will typically play a turn or two, then go do something else and come back a couple hours or a day later.)
Niopii wrote:I donno if it was already mentioned, but I personally would like to see Draws count as Draws instead of wins.
They count as wins? Really? I'd been under the impression that they don't show up in your win/loss tally at all.
Niopii wrote:A capture the flag/search and destroy game type would be interesting to see.
How do you see these as being substantially different from the existing Disputed (pick up three of five "flags" and get them off the map without dying) and Secure (prevent the other team from entering a designated section of the map and remaining there for three seconds) modes?
Space Voyager
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by Space Voyager » Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:06 pm

I wish the effect of being still wouldn't be as huge as it is. Right now a MGer, standing up from behind a cover, facing the exact enemy position, will be shot by a MGer behind the cover, even when this one has to turn like 30 degrees.

I'm not sure how exactly it works but turning around (considering the real aiming) should at some point be more time consuming than standing up, aim at ready.

The current system encourages turtling a lot, throwing more active players into a disadvantage.
rmsgrey
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by rmsgrey » Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:33 pm

Space Voyager wrote:I wish the effect of being still wouldn't be as huge as it is. Right now a MGer, standing up from behind a cover, facing the exact enemy position, will be shot by a MGer behind the cover, even when this one has to turn like 30 degrees.

I'm not sure how exactly it works but turning around (considering the real aiming) should at some point be more time consuming than standing up, aim at ready.

The current system encourages turtling a lot, throwing more active players into a disadvantage.
I believe standing/ducking has a worse penalty than horizontal movement, which sounds about right - it takes longer to complete a change in posture than to complete a step or freeze mid-step.
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NDervish
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by NDervish » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:34 am

rmsgrey wrote:
Space Voyager wrote:The current system encourages turtling a lot, throwing more active players into a disadvantage.
I believe standing/ducking has a worse penalty than horizontal movement, which sounds about right - it takes longer to complete a change in posture than to complete a step or freeze mid-step.
Nonetheless, Space Voyager has a point. If I have an MG in a small room with his back to a corner and aiming out, there's absolutely no way that you can take him out with a single MG of your own. The stillness bonus trumps all else, no matter how brilliant your tactics might be, despite the braindead simplicity of my own tactics ("stand in a corner so they can't get behind you, then wait").

This can really hurt in Secure games... Just bid the interior of a single room and (assuming you win the bid) put each defender in a corner, facing the center of the room. Barring explosives (which I don't think appear in Secure), there's no way the attacker can get in, save perhaps with a lucky shotgun rush that manages to take out at least two defenders before they get him, giving the attacker numerical superiority.

Granted, I like games where defense is a viable option and "Rush! Rush! Rush!" isn't the only viable strategy, but you've got to admit that it's boring if everyone just turtles because the first one who moves will place himself at a huge disadvantage. The magnitude of the stillness bonus in FS can sometimes have that effect.
GreenReaper
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Re: Wishlist thread

Post by GreenReaper » Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:19 pm

I would like to have a better visual aid for dark maps... instead of trying "line of sight" at each position, a visual aid of which ground is covered would be nice...

another thing that would be pretty nice,... a manual explaining basic parts of the game and especially all the advanced options, settings, weapon effects and range ... etc. That would be, if linked at the homepage and the wiki, a great asset to the game, esp for starters like me.

a map editor would be great. havent found it. if there already is an editor, several links on how to use or videoclips like "youtube tutorials" would be great.

generally speaking... a homepage where starters could find all the needed references for getting into the game with good facts and special hints...

IN FACT THIS GAME IS AWESOME !!!
KEEP IT UP GUYS !
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