THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

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Paul
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THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:31 pm

PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING IN THIS THREAD - ANY POSTS NOT ADHERING TO THE RULES WILL BE IGNORED AND POSSIBLY DELETED - THANK YOU!

About this Thread

This thread will be checked on a regular basis.

It is for the community to alert Mode 7 (the devs) to any issues which are hurting the game on a regular basis, or things that need addressing quickly.

For example, recently people thought that the most pressing issues were:

- Us being slow to patch and bad at communicating update timings
- Scoring
- Games not being finished

...so we acted as fast as we could to fix those.

Rules for Posting

It goes without saying that some of these things apply across the forum but I'll state them here.

- This is not a technical support thread

If you need technical support, please go here.

- No trolling, flaming or obvious stupidity

Feel free to insult us and the game, but just not on these forums and especially not in this thread! Thanks!

- We want to hear about issues that, in your opinion, affect the whole community, from high-level players to newbies

Obviously, this is quite subjective, but do consider it before posting.

- Fundamental gameplay changes won't be happening at this point, so don't suggest them!

e.g. "I think the game absolutely needs melee weapons and this is clearly causing players to leave" would be ignored

- Think about your tone

e.g. "Why haven't you fixed X? Oh yes, that's right, because all you care about is Y! Stupid developers!" would be ignored

- We're aiming more for things that need to be fixed rather than new features...

...but if you think the game is desperately lacking something that other games have, which is not a massive new feature, then definitely post. Otherwise, post in Wishlist.

Thanks for putting up with those slightly draconian rules - I just wanted to have a more structured thread that I can come to very regularly in order to keep the discussion going on high priority matters. This doesn't mean we'll stop reading Bugs and Wishlist (far from it - we'll look at those each time we update) but again, this is an EMERGENCY hotline that you can use to ping us and rouse us from the depths of the development cave.
Paul Kilduff-Taylor

Mode 7 Games
Eckie
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Eckie » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:48 pm

Great thread, love the rules as well! (topics can get messy sometimes)

So here's my first emergency call-in:

I've noticed my own interest in playing has dropped since the new ranking system was implemented. The reason for this is that I have no idea how any individual game has or will influence my ranking. This is because at the end of a match, the regular score is shown, and not the new Elo score.

Showing the Elo score at the end of a game would not be a huge fix I think (coding-wise), but would respark my interest in playing. Ultimately I'd like to see more clearness overall in the scoring (more on that in the "Elo half baked" thread) but on an emergency-level, knowing how individual games have influenced your Elo ranking would be a great improvement.

(It is hard for me to guesstimate how much of the user-base think the same about this, but since this is a global change chances are some of them do.)
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Paul
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:49 pm

Thanks - good post, although perhaps a little bit minor, as I don't think this is going to destroy the game, but I'll let you off :D - we'll definitely look into that one. I think we'll need a bit of time to make sure ELO has "settled in" before changes like that happen, but I'll raise this one.
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Eckie
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Eckie » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:59 pm

Paul wrote:Thanks - good post, although perhaps a little bit minor, as I don't think this is going to destroy the game, but I'll let you off :D - we'll definitely look into that one. I think we'll need a bit of time to make sure ELO has "settled in" before changes like that happen, but I'll raise this one.
Like I said, hard to judge whether this has a big impact on the entire community. All I know is that for me this small change would mean a world of difference! It would go from "Why play, i don't know what it does anyways?" to "Yeahhh lets beat Macci!! *roar*"

Anywho, thanks for considering.
Toeofdoom
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Toeofdoom » Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:11 pm

I'd say the ELO bugs could do with being fixed. Has the tweak actually been applied? I haven't seen much to suggest it has been and I'm pretty sure I lost points when I shouldn't have since the "ELO tweak" blog post. Additionally setting the score for timed-out games to 1 allows various exploits/unintended behaviour unless such games aren't ranked at all, which would be an exploit in itself.

It's a bit opaque from my point of view, trying to figure out what has actually changed and whether the system is working the way it should so I definitely support Eckie's suggestion too - ideally it would also be possible to see rank changes in the match history lists.

Essentially, the ELO implementation seems unproven but probably not quite right and it will be easier to see if it's working properly with some sort of feedback.
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:16 pm

OK, thanks - I'll look into that.
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wonderhero
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby wonderhero » Fri Sep 16, 2011 3:01 pm

Eckie wrote:The reason for this is that I have no idea how any individual game has or will influence my ranking. This is because at the end of a match, the regular score is shown, and not the new Elo score.
Showing the Elo score at the end of a game would not be a huge fix I think (coding-wise), but would respark my interest in playing.

I agree and also I suggest, if is possible, to show to player the minimum and maximum Elo score if he will lose/win in a individual game before submit first turn. Something like:
The score range of winning: 3 - 12
The score range of loss: 7 - 32
Paddon
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paddon » Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:14 pm

Uh, Well a quite unfair problem in-game is spawning inside a enclosed building with no possible exit.
Not sure if its as urgent as the problems you're referring to, but it is kinda aggravating.
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:42 pm

I'm under the impression that's currently extremely rare - is that not the case?
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Meneth
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Meneth » Fri Sep 16, 2011 6:05 pm

Paul wrote:I'm under the impression that's currently extremely rare - is that not the case?

So rare I've never had it happen in my ~300 games. I have seen a few games by other people where it has happened, though. Can't say I've ever heard of it happening to someone more than once or twice.
A much more frequent issue is Charge games where one team can only start out on a tiny sliver of his side due to walls blocking off most of the spawn area.
TheRaven42
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby TheRaven42 » Fri Sep 16, 2011 6:24 pm

Paul wrote:Thanks - good post, although perhaps a little bit minor, as I don't think this is going to destroy the game, but I'll let you off :D - we'll definitely look into that one. I think we'll need a bit of time to make sure ELO has "settled in" before changes like that happen, but I'll raise this one.



I honestly have not started any new games because of this. I want to know what I'm risking 'before' I start turn one, or have the option to play 'friendly' matches.

So I'll only play for tournament matches or on the experimental server until then.


"not going to destroy the game" If 2 people say they are playing less, I would say that means many more have already stopped playing completely without voicing any opinion (and they won't even if you ask), because most people will never complain, they will just go do something else.
Paddon
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paddon » Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:08 pm

Paul wrote:I'm under the impression that's currently extremely rare - is that not the case?

Happened to me twice ( i think ) , but i guess im just unlucky :(
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Paul
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:20 pm

Happened to me twice ( i think ) , but i guess im just unlucky :(


OK, I'll keep an eye on this and the weird charge spawn issue - thanks.
Paul Kilduff-Taylor

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Paul
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Paul » Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:24 pm

My current position on ELO is this - I think it should be clear what's happening to your ranking (i.e. is it moving up or down after games).

So, is the problem here that it's not displaying on the post-match screen, or that it's hard to see what's happening in the menus after you finish a match? Want to get that clear.

Knowing what you're "risking" by playing a game is, in my mind, an additional feature that could be looked at, but it's not important vs. ELO actually functioning correctly and being able to see the progress you're making.

Many, many games obfuscate what will happen to your ranking until AFTER playing a match - that's extremely common. Not saying that makes it right, I'm saying that makes it an additional possible feature rather than a necessity.

Just being completely honest here (let's see how that goes!)

In general I'm not going to debate the significance of things here because everyone's going to have a vastly different opinion on that. But I thought I would comment on this because ELO is a new change and we need to make sure it's ok in general.
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Meneth
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Re: THE MODE 7 HOTLINE

Postby Meneth » Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:38 pm

@Paul: It should say how many points you went up/down at the end of the match, and it should also be visible in the Match History. Elo rating should also be visible from a player's profile, while currently it is only visible on the global rankings.

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