New Player Viewpoint

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Zathri
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:49 am

New Player Viewpoint

Post by Zathri » Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:10 am

Hello. First off, great game. I love being able to get a quick game in under 15 minutes. Tactical and simplicity. I've recommended the game to my friends and I don't recommend many games. Too much to do, too little time. Anyway, it got me thinking that it might be helpful to list my initial hurdles which would prevent anyone but the driven strategist to get past the first few scenarios. Having played VGA Planets, Laser Squad, Laser Squad Nemesis, and a few hex based games, I dunno this might help sell more units.

I read the sticky about posting major changes in the wish list thread and I don't feel that these are major. They've probably been mentioned before, but with 34 pages and no real wishlist being maintained...

Keeping new players in mind and saving time planning, reducing the number of test runs required for planning a turn.

1. It's hard to know what type of unit will win a battle.
1a. Probably useful to show this in the tutorial of how a machine gunner aims, it can beat out a shotgunner and other useful variations.

2. More thorough documentation of who wins which battle and how it is calculated.
2a. Yeah I know that takes away part of the glory, but this is a tactical numbers based game.
2b. OK, so people have written guides. Remember, new players are not going to go to the forums to track these down. They've moved on by now.

3. Weaponry range is unknown
3a. A semi-transparent circle surrounding the unit as you test the move or place the waypoints would be excellent.

4. Line of sight is difficult to see
4a. Pressing V is helpful, but really a layer shading would be much more practical.
4b. Does the tutorial mention this? If not, it should.

5. Aiming angle is not so obvious
5a. It would be great if this was a little easier to see. Pale grey lines aren't enough for me at least.

6. Engage or contine on sight is not so obvious
6a. Perhaps waypoints and paths marked in green are engadge on sight while waypoints and paths in blue are continue on sight.

That's all that i have for keeping new comers interested and making the game flow better with less tedium.

Thanks! I've enjoyed the single player campaign very much.
Scorpion0x17
Posts: 508
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Re: New Player Viewpoint

Post by Scorpion0x17 » Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:59 am

Just thought I'd respond to your points, not because I think you're wrong to post them, but rather because whilst I agree with some of what you've posted, I may be able to offer a slightly different point of view where I don't:
Zathri wrote:1. It's hard to know what type of unit will win a battle.
1a. Probably useful to show this in the tutorial of how a machine gunner aims, it can beat out a shotgunner and other useful variations.
This comes with time. It's a little like playing a new FPS - you may have some idea of which guns are better, from playing other FPSs, but you only learn the specifics through playing the game.
Zathri wrote:2. More thorough documentation of who wins which battle and how it is calculated.
2a. Yeah I know that takes away part of the glory, but this is a tactical numbers based game.
2b. OK, so people have written guides. Remember, new players are not going to go to the forums to track these down. They've moved on by now.
This I also would like a little more detail on - mainly because, when you dig into how the people who have written guides, or offer advice, have obtained the detailed information within said guides, or advice, it turns out that it's through experimentation and guess work.
Zathri wrote:3. Weaponry range is unknown
3a. A semi-transparent circle surrounding the unit as you test the move or place the waypoints would be excellent.
There's only two units which have a limited range - the shotgun, and the grenade launcher - with the grenade launcher it's obvious what the range is when you drag the aim line out, and with the shotgun it can be seen using the V button.
Zathri wrote:4. Line of sight is difficult to see
4a. Pressing V is helpful, but really a layer shading would be much more practical.
4b. Does the tutorial mention this? If not, it should.
Not really sure why you think that. You select the unit you wish to test the line of site from, then you hold down V, and you drag the line to the point you wish to test the line of sight to.
Zathri wrote:5. Aiming angle is not so obvious
5a. It would be great if this was a little easier to see. Pale grey lines aren't enough for me at least.
Precise aiming is not important - a unit only need aim in a general direction - so something more obvious would run the risk of being more misleading.
Zathri wrote:6. Engage or contine on sight is not so obvious
6a. Perhaps waypoints and paths marked in green are engadge on sight while waypoints and paths in blue are continue on sight.
When you get used to the icons, it's rarely hard to see this information, and if you're in doubt you can just simulate the orders - if the unit has the fast-forward symbol by it, it's on continue on sight, if not, it isn't.
trolling [verb]:
Posting with the intention of provoking a reaction.
Zathri
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: New Player Viewpoint

Post by Zathri » Tue Jan 10, 2012 5:17 am

Thank you for your responses. I'm simply listing the initial difficulties that I had starting off and these in turn may be turn-offs for newcomers. Everything can be tested and retested, but having the information up front without simulating saves time and keeps the game flowing. It's the disjointedness that often turns new players off. If others agree that an aspect could be presented better, it may get the new player past the learning curve of the first few missions.



7. In the tutorial, practice moving the enemy.
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icebrain
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Re: New Player Viewpoint

Post by icebrain » Tue Jan 10, 2012 5:37 am

Zathri wrote: 2. More thorough documentation of who wins which battle and how it is calculated.
There was a feature that would tell why one unit won/lost an encounter but it was removed and never brought back despite everyone wanting it. It's the devs' will to provide very little help whether in-game, or in the tutorial/manual - and it's not now that it's gonna change. That's what led me to write a guide, and to create a tool that would bring some of the missing information (will be released in the next weeks).

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J.Mad
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Re: New Player Viewpoint

Post by J.Mad » Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:28 am

Zathri wrote: 5. Aiming angle is not so obvious
5a. It would be great if this was a little easier to see. Pale grey lines aren't enough for me at least.
In my opinion it's clear. Edge lines are most important and they are well visible.
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jhawk
Posts: 61
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Re: New Player Viewpoint

Post by jhawk » Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:44 pm

Scorpion0x17 wrote:There's only two units which have a limited range - the shotgun, and the grenade launcher - with the grenade launcher it's obvious what the range is when you drag the aim line out, and with the shotgun it can be seen using the V button.
The MG also has a limited range. But it is seldom that a target is beyond that range.

With the SG you sometimes want to check the range beyond some cover, which is difficult to judge because the line will be thicker at any distance behind that cover.

I also agree with all the other points made in the OP.

The LOS suggestion and better readability of the COS/EOS orders would be nice polish to have, but admittedly not too important.

The in-game help system feels pretty archaic in design, and could be expanded in many areas.
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